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  • cummings 4 bt's not an issue

    Greetings,

    I am a proud owner of a 2001, 28 w/Cummings 4bt's. I have heard other boat owners talking about these engines, talking them down. My boat had issues as well, in regards to the engines and speed. Full rpm was 2800 at 23 knots. Being a new owner I could not understand what was happening with this boat.
    First I gave a Mac a call at the factory and discussed many possibilites as to where the problems lied. These were his recommendations to check-

    1st - props were to be 1721's with a #5 cup.
    2nd- the condition of the bottom is very important. Mac recommended I sand the bottom with 100 grit, clean well and put a fresh coat of bottom paint on with a foam roller.
    #3 - Make sure I was getting full throw on the injector pump throttles. I currantly have 1000 hrs on the original cables, which are now 5 yrs. old. There was play in the cables as well. They have been replaced.
    #4 - Most important on the 4bt's are the injectors. I noticed I had a slight slick coming from both my engines, at idle. I gave Cummings Metro a call and spoke to Paul McAllister. He told me the injectors on these engines have a lifetime guarantee. Thus recommending the injectors should be changed every 250 hrs. The one and only problem these injectors have are, when the engines are overloaded and not getting full rpm the injector tips get hot. Causing the tips to melt. Which leads to not a good spray into the cylinders. Wide open rpm 3100 is recommended by Cummings., 250 rpm off the pins is recommended high cruise. Which will give you a speed fo 29 kts. with full fuel and 3 passengers on board.
    I have had all these problems and have taken care of them one by one.
    At this time my boat low cruise 2600 at 26 kts. 2800 at 28 kts. and 3100 I am doing 30.8 kts.
    The wide open rpm's will vary 50 rpm's with the enviroment temp. air and water.
    She is an extremely economical boat with all the speed you need. In my opinion the boat is not underpowered as others say.
    You see it's all about getting the variables correct. Easy process. Attack them one at a time.
    Hope this helps anyone with the same problems I have been reading about the last 5 months.
    Love this boat. Everything I need it to be in an off-shore boat. Not only does it have a great ride it has the speed, room and all the emenities. And it does raise fish trolling!
    Feel free to e-mail me anytime and cell number 609-954-9769.

    Yours Truly,
    Captain Ernie
    Fintastic
    28 CC
    Cummings 4bt's
    Captain Ernie
    Fintastic
    28 CC
    Cummins 4 bt's
    Forked River Barneget Inlet, NJ
    sigpic

  • #2
    I have the same engine package, and agree with everything in your post - but the comment by Cummins Metro is a bit puzzling. If the injectors have a lifetime guarantee, why does Paul recommend they be changed every 250 hours?
    Capt. B

    Now a 2014 28' Regulator
    Wall, NJ

    Comment


    • #3
      to Capt B

      Good question. The 28 CC is just that! A 28 ft boat, but it has the feel of a 35/40 ft. boat. If I'm not mistaken the weight of as 28 CC is 15,000 lbs. After fuel. tackle, rods and reels, 2 sleeves of ice, 8 flats of chum weighting 30lbs each and when I run offshore I carry an additional 1800 ft. of anchor line, 30 ft of 5/8 chain and a 25 lb. anchor. Don't forget food, beverages and personal supples for 2 days and at least 3 men. As of yet I have not had to take additional fuel with me, I hold approximately 220 gal. of fuel, give or take.
      I am sure you are probably looking at an additonal, 5 to 7000 lb. extra weight.
      Which leaves you quite a load on your power. For many guys going out to the canyon, I am sure their load factor is very simular. Running out to the canyon pulling your throttles up to cruising rpm under that much load is not correct. What I do as I run out the inlet, I put my boat to the pins with that load factor, if my rpms are 28 I will back off throttle 300 rpm and that is my set cruise out to the canyon. Cruising at 23 knots. If you don't run it this way you will have trouble with the injectors overloading and overheating.
      Paul McAllister told me the 28 CC only has this problem because no other boat out there can handle the wt/load factor.
      28 CC is a real battleship, the only limitations I feel we have is just backing off the throttle a little bit and still get good fuel economy. Other engines I here about blowing volves, scaring cylinders and problems w/barrings when dissels are overloaded. With the cummings 4bt's be careful not to overload the engine or you will have problems with the injector tips.
      That is why they recommend changing them every 250 hrs.
      Captain Ernie
      Fintastic
      28 CC
      Cummings 4bt's
      Captain Ernie
      Fintastic
      28 CC
      Cummins 4 bt's
      Forked River Barneget Inlet, NJ
      sigpic

      Comment


      • #4
        Just Curious

        250 Hours seems a bit obsessive. I just had mine changed for the first time and frankly the boat isnt running as well as it did before I changed them. I'm pulling mine next month too do all the maintenance. I'm running 24-26 knots. Before it was more like 26-28.

        I was wondering about the rpm you guys are turning. I am able to get the full 3000 with two people and fuel. I do have a tower. I have been a little hesitant to run over ~2500 rpms. Sounds like 2700 won't do any damage except to the pocket book. Do I understand this correctly?

        I have about 1400 hrs on my 2001

        Ron Wade
        Sea Gypsy
        Last edited by Sea Gypsy; 12-26-2007, 02:03 PM.
        Sea Gypsy
        28 Carolina Classic

        Comment


        • #5
          Satisfied with 4b250's

          I have commented before about the performance of my 2003 CC28 with 4b's. I have had very few problems or issues with the boat, engines, or electronics. I did have to have the injectors replaced at around 600 hrs. I have only put 200 hrs on since the injector problem. I run the engines at least every 10 days, frequently without coming off the lift. After reading some of the posts, I thought I would share the following. I ran the boat today during slack tide, no wind, 59 degrees, relatively low humidity, 1/2 tank of fuel, no tower, no gen, just me aboard. The sweet spot has always been between 2400 and 2600. Today was great 2400/26 kts....2600/28 kts....2800/29.7 kts....3000/32 kts. This was the first time that I have seen 32 kts without tide and/or wind help.

          Agitator
          CC28

          Comment


          • #6
            Greetings,
            That speed you are getting is fantastic. I believe the best I heard from Mac out of the factory, with no bottom paint was 32 knots. That's with a tower and gen.
            Curious, which props do you have on your boat, do you have the high torque1721's or the acme 1720's. I will be ordering the acme props for my boat soon. I currently have the 2001 w/the 4 bt's, tower and 5kw generator. Just had my starboard injectors done, under warrenty by Cummings.
            These injectors are guaranteed for life under Cummings for Carolina Classic's only, the only issue is travel time. The local Cummings dealer in my area waved that....
            Since it was only 3 miles from his shop.
            I didn't notice any difference in the engine sound w/the new injectors. But, did notice a considerable increase in fuel ecomony and no fuel coming out of exhausts at idle.
            Doing a few different upgrades, new 21 in flat screen tv, raising the outriggers 3 ft. Adding a center outrigger and last but not least installing 2 500 watt. halageons on the tower.
            That's it for this year.
            PS looking forward to getting off shore out of Barnaget NJ. Love that Blue Water.
            Last edited by capt ernie; 01-13-2008, 07:42 PM.
            Captain Ernie
            Fintastic
            28 CC
            Cummins 4 bt's
            Forked River Barneget Inlet, NJ
            sigpic

            Comment


            • #7
              Satisfied with 4b250's

              Ernest, I have the standard 1721 High Torque props that came on the boat. I was going to pull them this winter, but they are clean and undinged and I am pulling 3000 rpm on the pins. With the boat stored on a lift, I can check the running gear, bottom, and intakes on a regular basis. As I mentioned the boat is without a tower or genset. I have been meticulous in keeping extraneous gear out of the boat so as not to gain weight. I have the advantage of keeping the boat at home, so I can load for each trip. Additionally, I try to have as few systems that add complexity as possible since I do most of my own maintenance. The Agitator would be considered a very "bare bones" boat, but it has been both efficient and reliable for the past 5 years. The boat is not fast out of the hole, but is very acceptable if the engine temps are up to 125-150 degrees before powering up.
              I envy you the flat screen TV, but either one of my ham fisted fishing buddies or I would put a rod butt through the screen! Enjoy your great boat!

              Agitator
              CC28

              Comment

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